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	<title>Comments on: time of death</title>
	<link>http://www.aboutanurse.com/2007/03/time-of-death.html</link>
	<description>a nurse blog.</description>
	<pubDate>Thu, 20 Nov 2008 10:55:05 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>by: Valerie</title>
		<link>http://www.aboutanurse.com/2007/03/time-of-death.html#comment-22524</link>
		<pubDate>Tue, 17 Apr 2007 13:46:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.aboutanurse.com/2007/03/time-of-death.html#comment-22524</guid>
					<description>I have often wondered about "time". I lost my son to a drunk driver. A week before he said "I have no reason to live". Also, the day he left and was hit, I told him not to go that it was going to rain and I didnt want him out on a rainy night. Was this coincedence? Since then I have talked with people in M.A.D.D. One girl who lost her son to drunk driver said that her son's g/f's mom said he couldn't go with them. The girl and her mom left and got a ways away and decided to turn back and get the boy and bring him with them. Later that night he was killed while with his g/f(girl wasnt hit). Was this coincedence? Another womans son wanted a ride to store to get cigarettes, she told her son that he doesnt need to smoke and needs to quit. He decided to walk then, as soon as he left she felt she should of gave him ride. He was hit by a drunk driver and killed. Another woman's daughter was grounded. Her daughter's b/f came over and he is only around every other weekend. So the woman let her daughter off groundation to go with the b/f. Both were killed by drunk driver. Coincedence?...It is like there was something there to stop each thing from happening((rain, not going,giving ride, groundation)). Creepy to think about. If in each situation, I kept my son home cause of the rain, woman never came back to get the boy, woman gave ride, woman kept daughter on groundation, outcome would be different. Makes me think is there a warning but maybe we don't see them because we are blind to them or are we blind to them because it is their "time".</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have often wondered about &#8220;time&#8221;. I lost my son to a drunk driver. A week before he said &#8220;I have no reason to live&#8221;. Also, the day he left and was hit, I told him not to go that it was going to rain and I didnt want him out on a rainy night. Was this coincedence? Since then I have talked with people in M.A.D.D. One girl who lost her son to drunk driver said that her son&#8217;s g/f&#8217;s mom said he couldn&#8217;t go with them. The girl and her mom left and got a ways away and decided to turn back and get the boy and bring him with them. Later that night he was killed while with his g/f(girl wasnt hit). Was this coincedence? Another womans son wanted a ride to store to get cigarettes, she told her son that he doesnt need to smoke and needs to quit. He decided to walk then, as soon as he left she felt she should of gave him ride. He was hit by a drunk driver and killed. Another woman&#8217;s daughter was grounded. Her daughter&#8217;s b/f came over and he is only around every other weekend. So the woman let her daughter off groundation to go with the b/f. Both were killed by drunk driver. Coincedence?&#8230;It is like there was something there to stop each thing from happening((rain, not going,giving ride, groundation)). Creepy to think about. If in each situation, I kept my son home cause of the rain, woman never came back to get the boy, woman gave ride, woman kept daughter on groundation, outcome would be different. Makes me think is there a warning but maybe we don&#8217;t see them because we are blind to them or are we blind to them because it is their &#8220;time&#8221;.
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		<title>by: Dr Emer</title>
		<link>http://www.aboutanurse.com/2007/03/time-of-death.html#comment-21065</link>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Apr 2007 21:11:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.aboutanurse.com/2007/03/time-of-death.html#comment-21065</guid>
					<description>"can medicine really claim credit when a patient&#8217;s life is prolonged or saved?"

- to a certain degree, yes, especially if it is a simple case. dvt can cause pulmonary embolism so it can be explained. but most cases are not simple. the patient you described probably has other ailments influencing his major condition. in my experience, a confluence of bad factors usually kills the patient. medicine can safely claim credit to the explanation part whether the patient survived or not; it cannot always say it saved the day because for all its merits, it remains an imperfect science. 

"can we really say we knew what to do and we did it well, thus preventing death?"

- not all the time. as i said it remains an imperfect science. we discover new things as we go along.


"...or can we really blame stupid or slow doctors and nurses, lack of modern technology, lousy lab technicians for losing a loved a one?"

- sometimes, yes. technical errors can kill. wrong dosages. wrong medication given. leaving a surgical scissors inside the patient. sleepy doctors making bad decisions. fast iv instead of slow iv. 


Consider a health-conscious person who never smokes, eats the right food, exercises often, and has laboratory exam values any doctor will be happy about. He is as healthy as the finest definition of what healthy is. But what happens? While crossing the road, he gets hit by a speeding car, and dies immediately. 

What do you call that? Is that because he was negligent in looking first before crossing the street, or is that because it was his time already to die?

A friend priest insists the answer is the latter, but my personal belief is that there is always an explanation why things happen. The man is religiously strict when it comes to obvious health matters, but I think he was not paying attention to basic safety precautions when crossing the street. Simple matter, but fatal in the end. Still, there was an explanation.

Of course, I can be wrong. But that is my opinion. Solomon says there is a time to die. For me that means some sort of guide post and not a fate matter that determines our future whether we like it or not. Free will exists and we can choose what we want to happen in this life. Our inability to have definite answers to some questions should not push us to be impatient enough to believe that the flow of things have been preordained. The answers are there somehow. We should be patient enough to wait and discover them.

My dos sentimos. Forgive me if it was lengthy.

Happy Easter, May!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;can medicine really claim credit when a patient&#8217;s life is prolonged or saved?&#8221;</p>
<p>- to a certain degree, yes, especially if it is a simple case. dvt can cause pulmonary embolism so it can be explained. but most cases are not simple. the patient you described probably has other ailments influencing his major condition. in my experience, a confluence of bad factors usually kills the patient. medicine can safely claim credit to the explanation part whether the patient survived or not; it cannot always say it saved the day because for all its merits, it remains an imperfect science. </p>
<p>&#8220;can we really say we knew what to do and we did it well, thus preventing death?&#8221;</p>
<p>- not all the time. as i said it remains an imperfect science. we discover new things as we go along.</p>
<p>&#8220;&#8230;or can we really blame stupid or slow doctors and nurses, lack of modern technology, lousy lab technicians for losing a loved a one?&#8221;</p>
<p>- sometimes, yes. technical errors can kill. wrong dosages. wrong medication given. leaving a surgical scissors inside the patient. sleepy doctors making bad decisions. fast iv instead of slow iv. </p>
<p>Consider a health-conscious person who never smokes, eats the right food, exercises often, and has laboratory exam values any doctor will be happy about. He is as healthy as the finest definition of what healthy is. But what happens? While crossing the road, he gets hit by a speeding car, and dies immediately. </p>
<p>What do you call that? Is that because he was negligent in looking first before crossing the street, or is that because it was his time already to die?</p>
<p>A friend priest insists the answer is the latter, but my personal belief is that there is always an explanation why things happen. The man is religiously strict when it comes to obvious health matters, but I think he was not paying attention to basic safety precautions when crossing the street. Simple matter, but fatal in the end. Still, there was an explanation.</p>
<p>Of course, I can be wrong. But that is my opinion. Solomon says there is a time to die. For me that means some sort of guide post and not a fate matter that determines our future whether we like it or not. Free will exists and we can choose what we want to happen in this life. Our inability to have definite answers to some questions should not push us to be impatient enough to believe that the flow of things have been preordained. The answers are there somehow. We should be patient enough to wait and discover them.</p>
<p>My dos sentimos. Forgive me if it was lengthy.</p>
<p>Happy Easter, May!
</p>
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		<title>by: Kim</title>
		<link>http://www.aboutanurse.com/2007/03/time-of-death.html#comment-19572</link>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Mar 2007 21:19:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.aboutanurse.com/2007/03/time-of-death.html#comment-19572</guid>
					<description>Wow, great post! I once said that a code was like having a tug-of-war with God and the only reason we "win" is because God lets go of the rope and allows us to.

Every single one of your thoughts has crossed my mind at one time or another.  The CCU patient who wants her husband at 0300 and wants him NOW and then codes within the hour...(we got the husband, thank goodness).

Hmmm...I feel a blog post inspiration coming on....</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wow, great post! I once said that a code was like having a tug-of-war with God and the only reason we &#8220;win&#8221; is because God lets go of the rope and allows us to.</p>
<p>Every single one of your thoughts has crossed my mind at one time or another.  The CCU patient who wants her husband at 0300 and wants him NOW and then codes within the hour&#8230;(we got the husband, thank goodness).</p>
<p>Hmmm&#8230;I feel a blog post inspiration coming on&#8230;.
</p>
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		<title>by: Peggy</title>
		<link>http://www.aboutanurse.com/2007/03/time-of-death.html#comment-19022</link>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Mar 2007 12:31:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.aboutanurse.com/2007/03/time-of-death.html#comment-19022</guid>
					<description>The intimacy of the blogosphere is extraordinary! Your post, nurse May, is so beautifully written I anguished with you over that patient.

I believe there is 'a time' for my death and that the clock was set at my birth, in my physiology, as Moof says. I've always felt a strong sense of responsibility for taking as good care of myself as possible -- mentally, physically, spiritually -- so that whatever opportunities or difficulties come I can make the most of them, to my benefit and to others'. To me, there is great hope in this perspective because each day is another chance to exercise my power to order my thoughts and to rediscover what is most valuable to me.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The intimacy of the blogosphere is extraordinary! Your post, nurse May, is so beautifully written I anguished with you over that patient.</p>
<p>I believe there is &#8216;a time&#8217; for my death and that the clock was set at my birth, in my physiology, as Moof says. I&#8217;ve always felt a strong sense of responsibility for taking as good care of myself as possible &#8212; mentally, physically, spiritually &#8212; so that whatever opportunities or difficulties come I can make the most of them, to my benefit and to others&#8217;. To me, there is great hope in this perspective because each day is another chance to exercise my power to order my thoughts and to rediscover what is most valuable to me.
</p>
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		<title>by: Jen</title>
		<link>http://www.aboutanurse.com/2007/03/time-of-death.html#comment-18583</link>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Mar 2007 06:56:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.aboutanurse.com/2007/03/time-of-death.html#comment-18583</guid>
					<description>Speaking of "timing" - how ironic that you chose this particular day to post on this topic...

Friday was the first time in my life that I have seen someone after they had died.  The nursing home where I was doing my clinical had lost one of its residents during the night, and we were "fortunate" to have the "learning opportunity" to be involved in the after care.  Unfortunately, over-emotional me was a blubbering idiot, so was pretty much useless.

I know this is something to get used to, as you and others have stated, it becomes very common in nursing practice, but a difficult task, nonetheless, trying to learn to accept it...

I am trying to get up the nerve to blog about my experience and thoughts soon, but I'm not ready yet - still trying to get the images out of my head!!  Makes me respect all of you seasoned nurses so much more.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Speaking of &#8220;timing&#8221; - how ironic that you chose this particular day to post on this topic&#8230;</p>
<p>Friday was the first time in my life that I have seen someone after they had died.  The nursing home where I was doing my clinical had lost one of its residents during the night, and we were &#8220;fortunate&#8221; to have the &#8220;learning opportunity&#8221; to be involved in the after care.  Unfortunately, over-emotional me was a blubbering idiot, so was pretty much useless.</p>
<p>I know this is something to get used to, as you and others have stated, it becomes very common in nursing practice, but a difficult task, nonetheless, trying to learn to accept it&#8230;</p>
<p>I am trying to get up the nerve to blog about my experience and thoughts soon, but I&#8217;m not ready yet - still trying to get the images out of my head!!  Makes me respect all of you seasoned nurses so much more.
</p>
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		<title>by: shrimplate</title>
		<link>http://www.aboutanurse.com/2007/03/time-of-death.html#comment-18540</link>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Mar 2007 04:08:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.aboutanurse.com/2007/03/time-of-death.html#comment-18540</guid>
					<description>Well done.

Personally I prefer questions over answers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well done.</p>
<p>Personally I prefer questions over answers.
</p>
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		<title>by: mrs.r</title>
		<link>http://www.aboutanurse.com/2007/03/time-of-death.html#comment-18529</link>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Mar 2007 03:05:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.aboutanurse.com/2007/03/time-of-death.html#comment-18529</guid>
					<description>Oh my!  That is some pretty deep writing.  I have always thought of myself as a deep thinker, but I have never been able to express it so well!

i am guilty of using "it was just there time" or " there is a reason for this/everything".  I am also guilty of having a weak faith in God, although to be honest, I never let my patients know that.  I have days were i really believe i, and days that I just say it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh my!  That is some pretty deep writing.  I have always thought of myself as a deep thinker, but I have never been able to express it so well!</p>
<p>i am guilty of using &#8220;it was just there time&#8221; or &#8221; there is a reason for this/everything&#8221;.  I am also guilty of having a weak faith in God, although to be honest, I never let my patients know that.  I have days were i really believe i, and days that I just say it.
</p>
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		<title>by: kt</title>
		<link>http://www.aboutanurse.com/2007/03/time-of-death.html#comment-18468</link>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Mar 2007 20:50:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.aboutanurse.com/2007/03/time-of-death.html#comment-18468</guid>
					<description>such a great post may!  all of those questions are confusing b/c not a single one has a straight answer. time of death always has me scratching my head...why a 20year with leukemia, why the car accident, why the unanticipated M.I. in the middle of the workday?  it leaves a persons mind restless because there is no antidote for the pain of losing someone you love. (this is my thought anways :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>such a great post may!  all of those questions are confusing b/c not a single one has a straight answer. time of death always has me scratching my head&#8230;why a 20year with leukemia, why the car accident, why the unanticipated M.I. in the middle of the workday?  it leaves a persons mind restless because there is no antidote for the pain of losing someone you love. (this is my thought anways <img src='http://www.aboutanurse.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' />
</p>
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		<title>by: Rygel</title>
		<link>http://www.aboutanurse.com/2007/03/time-of-death.html#comment-18385</link>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Mar 2007 05:41:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.aboutanurse.com/2007/03/time-of-death.html#comment-18385</guid>
					<description>We all have a 'time' to go but sometimes, especially in the medical field i can't help but feel that some people make that time come a lot sooner :) of course they also delay it sometimes</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We all have a &#8216;time&#8217; to go but sometimes, especially in the medical field i can&#8217;t help but feel that some people make that time come a lot sooner <img src='http://www.aboutanurse.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' />  of course they also delay it sometimes
</p>
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		<title>by: The Curmudgeon</title>
		<link>http://www.aboutanurse.com/2007/03/time-of-death.html#comment-18357</link>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Mar 2007 04:03:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.aboutanurse.com/2007/03/time-of-death.html#comment-18357</guid>
					<description>May, I'll give you my mother's answer: Man proposes, God disposes.

It's not a bad answer when you think about it: There may be such a thing as "your time" -- but that's in God's hands, not ours -- and we get to rage, rage against the dying of the light right up until the decision is taken out of our hands.

And I sure wouldn't want to tempt fate on the theory that it's not yet "my time!"

Interesting read.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>May, I&#8217;ll give you my mother&#8217;s answer: Man proposes, God disposes.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s not a bad answer when you think about it: There may be such a thing as &#8220;your time&#8221; &#8212; but that&#8217;s in God&#8217;s hands, not ours &#8212; and we get to rage, rage against the dying of the light right up until the decision is taken out of our hands.</p>
<p>And I sure wouldn&#8217;t want to tempt fate on the theory that it&#8217;s not yet &#8220;my time!&#8221;</p>
<p>Interesting read.
</p>
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